Top 3 contenders for Mike Babcock

Top 3 contenders for Mike Babcock
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37 Responses to Top 3 contenders for Mike Babcock

  1. leafy says:

    I can’t wait for the playoffs to end so there can be huge trades again.

  2. nordiques100 says:

    I think there will be a lot of activity Leafy.

    There is definitely going to be a huge coaching carousel too with 6-10 openings potentially.

    Detroit may need a coach if Babcock leaves. It will be their AHL coach me thinks in Jeff Blaishill

    Edmonton looking, likely McLellan.

    San Jose has a need. May be Babcock.

    Philly is where i think Babcock goes.

    St Louis and Boston have not decided on their coaches yet and whether they stay or go. Dave Tippett is too not 100 percent certain to go back to Arizona.

    Shero needs to make a choice too in Jersey.

    Buffalo is looking as well for a coach. They`re in the Babcock running.

    There are coaches like Carlyle, MacLean, McLellan, Todd Nelson, Jeff Blaishill all on the list of available ones.

    And then there is the Leafs. who need a coach and GM.

    I personally would love to see Mike Futa added as the team`s GM. they also find a way to fit Sean Burke in a director role plus goalie coach. And Joe Nieuwendyk find his way back to Toronto adding a former GM to the mix.

    Then my personal fav choice to coach the leafs would be Tippett. But i don`t think he leaves Phoenix, i am holding hope he does. He`d be a great coach for the Leafs. Structured, defensive minded, very systems oriented.

  3. nordiques100 says:

    I am really torn on this Kessel thing.

    I agree, would like to see decent value back. Seems like the asking price is a high pick, a top prospect/young top 6 forward roster player, another prospect. Perhaps taking a contract back.

    But man, if the situation presented itself, with both Strome and Marner available at 4 for the Leafs, I’d be totally offering Kessel and whatever to get the 5th overall from Carolina.

    I know, its a leap of faith maybe. A risk. A jump to the unknown with us talking about 2 18 year old teenagers with lots to prove still. And having no guarantees they will turn out as the experts are guessing.

    But, pretty much all the experts and scouts agree, Strome and Marner are excellent prospects. They have a high ceiling.

    And, its also hard to predict whether Toronto has the ability to develop them into top players. Or whether or not this is still a place where young players go to die.

    But i am really tempted to do it. I’d even include the Nashville pick and take back Semin if need be.

    There is a chance there for Toronto to get their version of Kane/Toews with Marner/Strome. Two players who have big potential. Would start the rebuild process on a great high.

    Let me ask you, are you excited more with having Kessel as the Leafs best player still, or starting over with Marner/Strome together? I’m leaning towards the latter.

    I am still though extremely skeptical Carolina would trade their pick. But man if they had an sliver of interest, i’d be running with that trying hard to convince them to move that pick.

    • Steven_Leafs0 says:

      I’m not that much of a fan of moving Kessel AND the 25th pick in a deep draft (last deep draft Perry and Getzlaf were taken that low) for the 5th overall pick. It is just bad asset management. Kessel alone should be worth (and every expert agrees):
      -a young top 6 forward or top 4 defenceman
      -a top blue chip prospect
      -1st round pick

      So from Carolina we are looking at Skinner, Fleury, 35th overall pick / 2016 LA 1st as a best case scenario. Dropping the player, prospect and pick to take the 5th overall pick and give them a 1st AND take on their cap dump is just bad and slows the rebuild from 3-5 years to 5-7 years (assuming the 5th overall pick isn’t a bust or depth NHLer.

      Also I think if we are taking Semin’s contract we HAVE TO ask for more. We cannot accept taking a bad contract back as acceptable without payment.

      Let’s say both teams find a fair deal for Kessel, for us to take Semin back Carolina has to include more. How much more depends on how good the deal is but it should be more IMO.

      • LN91 says:

        You are never getting that sort of deal for Kessel. Not even Rick Nash got that.

        You are most likely getting a project prospect with a higher ceiling, a young roster player (more of a 2nd pairing player) and a 1st in 2016. That is why most of these deals fall apart for the team trading away the star.

        I agree with you Nords, it’s a leap of faith…But a combo of Hanifin/Strome/Marner could set this team up for decades which Toronto needs to consider.

        • Steven_Leafs0 says:

          Which is basically what I entered, just downgrade Fleury and we have the same offer. Which means if we take on Semin for a cap dump, then we have to get a Fleury level prospect. Either that or swap a couple of those pieces for the 5th overall pick, etc.

          Anyway my major point was we need a fair offer for Kessel not including cap dumps, if you want to send us back a bad contract like Semin or Weiss then you have to improve that offer.

        • nordiques100 says:

          I completely understand. Knowing what we know now, with Seguin and Hamilton being the two pieces that ended up with the other team in the Kessel trade, the Leafs and Leaf nation would love to see that recouped in 1 trade. Make up the last decade of awfulness.

          But for the Leafs it is a journey. A likely long journey that could shorten with proper guidance and proper management and development.

          The direction and message seems very clear for the organization. Build from the draft. Draft and develop young, highly regarded prospects when the opportunity presents itself.

          To do that, you do need draft picks. If they some how, some way managed to get 2 picks in the top 5, that could set them up pretty well and i would argue speed up the rebuild adding two blue chippers now, rather than 1 now, 1 next year. They could add 2 now, and 1 next year and be on pace for a good future. It again all depends on how they bring them along, a chance i would take considering they’re bringing in a fresh group of people to do the scouting and developing.

          Yes, you want to hit the home run on the Kessel trade. But, if there is a sliver of interest by the Canes, that can be driven to be significant interests and the trade centres around Kessel, and perhaps ends up with a high price given up by Toronto, Do it. What do they have to lose?

          Success has not been found at all with the current leafs group that has Kessel as its best player.

          It indeed a leap of faith, a risk, a chance, a defining moment for this management group. But, by all accounts, there is a lot of high regard for any of Hanifin, Marner and Strome. I have stronger belief these players will turn into excellent NHLers than I do having Kessel be our top player and leading us to the playoffs and playoff success. Its not going to happen with him here. So if something of this magnitude is on the table, I just don’t see a point hoping to see if some team falls off their rocker and deals the sun and the moon for Kessel.

          Dave Nonis is gone. He was the only one with the team who still believed with Kessel and Phaneuf, the Leafs can win with them. He was the one off his rocker.

          • TmLeafan says:

            Are you seriously suggesting trading Phil Kessel for a 5th overall pick? On top of that adding an additional first and taking back one of the worst contracts in the league?

            Such a bad deal for the Leafs

            • TmLeafan says:

              Also Phil Kessel is better than Rick Nash.

              On top of that Nash trade is not even a valid comparable as he had a full no trade clause at the time and basically forced a trade to the Rangers.

      • Gambo says:

        I can’t see any reason why anyone would want to keep Kessel on the leafs. The only argument I could sort of understand was if they drafted McDavid, but I still wouldn’t keep Kessel then.

        • Steven_Leafs0 says:

          If the offer was a draft pick and a cap dump then you keep Kessel. I’d rather have him then get nothing for him.

          • LN91 says:

            Then the Leafs are just delaying any success.

            As much as Toronto says they do not need to keep Kessel, the truth is they need to get rid of him this summer.

            • nordiques100 says:

              The other thing too, they need to get rid of many of them.

              Keep in mind, it wont be just a Kessel trade, and the Leafs are done for the next decade.

              They have Phaneuf to trade. Probably Bozak and Lupul. If the contract negotiations go sideways on Kadri and Bernier, there is no guarantee they will be back.

              And then there are JVR and Gardiner, players they will likely keep, but who are not untouchables.

              There is a core group that just needs to be detonated. It will take time. But for Kessel and Phaneuf i think too they both need to be gone sooner than later.

            • Steven_Leafs0 says:

              Here is my issue with that comment. Kessel is not the problem. After the rebuild is done we will need a Kessel level player or 2. Look at the team’s in the second round. Every single one of them has at least one. More than one.

              Also if Kessel is the problem then why would anyone want him? Just waive him and buy him out if that is the case.

              My main point is we cannot blow up the team for scraps. Our main problem was poor asset management, turning decent players with value for pieces that we immediately move for nothing. That example of the Kaberle deal was the best. We moved him for pieces (a lot of good ones mind you) then moved them out for nothing.

              Colborne? Gone and doing well.
              1st? Traded with a 2nd for Biggs.
              If we do that with Kessel then our 3-5 year build will be infinitely longer.

              • Gambo says:

                They need to build a young core first, and then look to add veteren scorers or whatever needed to become contenders. You don’t put the condom on after you have sex.

                The core should be reletively in the same age range, not one being 10 years older.

                The future core should start with Rielly, Nylander, Strome/Hanifin, hopefully another top pick from this years draft from trading Kessel and/or Phaneuf, and a high 1st rounder next year.
                That’s 5 or 6 homegrown high 1st round draft picks all within 5 years of eachother. Then you have JVR, Kadri, Brown, Gauthier,Gardiner, and other asets acquired or held onto that can be recycled over the years.

                If you can get a top 8 pick in this years draft for Kessel, you have to do it. Even if it means taking on a cap dump. Ideally you’d want a veteran leader with experience to be that cap dump and not an older version of Kessel like Semin, but either way you gotta do it.

                • LN91 says:

                  I agree Gambo.

                  Poor ‘asset’ management (as Steven likes to put it) is more related to young players and draft picks, as opposed to players in there prime.

                  Also, how is Kessel not the problem? Toronto has 0 leadership on this squad and he/Phaneuf were the players that were supposed to provide.

                  Toronto needs a culture change as well, and for that, kessel has to go.

              • nordiques100 says:

                It is hard to provide support with the way you’re looking at it.

                The thing is, you’re already thinking, that if Toronto got another top 5-6 pick for Kessel, its scraps. That’s where you need to change the mindset.

                I am sure those who have countered your point, Gambo, LN91, myself, yes we all agree, we would love for Kessel to fetch a 1st, a top prospect, a young roster player and so forth. We’re not saying that we don’t like that. I don’t think we’re saying either that this is the be-all-end-all scenario for Kessel, nor is what we think is to be the be-all-end-all either.

                We, at least I, am exploring whatever avenues that may be out there. And even what we want, trading Kessel for the 5th overall pretty well straight up and taking on a bad contract, is even improbable.

                Teams hardly trade top 10 picks, let alone top 5. Because as LN91 said above, the teams trading the proven NHL star balk at it to get an 18 year old kid.

                But i think its a completely different situation here. Kessel and Phaneuf have not helped the Leafs win nor will they or can be main top player on your team cornerstones to build around.

                Secondly, if the opportunity presented itself to get 2 top young prospects, 2 highly regarded draftees, 2 players who play in the GTA, 2 players who can grow together at the same time, that sounds pretty unique and something worth chasing.

                And lastly, skill wise, Kessel, Phaneuf, others, they have skill. No doubt. They weren’t all-stars for nothing. As team players, as players who can provide leadership and intangibles that go beyond the stats, they’re awful. If you want them to be the ones mentoring the youthful players coming in, I would just give up now. I would then agree with you, the 5th pick would be scrap because at some point they’ll learn how Kessel gets by, gets 8 mil a season, gets no playoff games, yet gets still put on a pedestal.

                • kessel_leafs81 says:

                  Yes leaderships the problem, I think a culture change needs too happen but I am not giving away kessel for a discounted price, in three years we could be looking for a sniper to play alongside whoever we draft now and nylander/JVR.. that being said, if strome and marner being available at our position, i dont know how you offer up kessel for that pick. Not only does carolina want to make playoffs now with staals aging, but not having kessel and hopefully dealing phaneuf.. our team will be worse next year so that trade will also benefit the team in a sense of a better team next year. Seems like people are forgetting about nylander too. Definitely has the sill set of a top six forward. Having nylander-strome-marner to build on for forwards is an extremely good start. a 26 year old JVR should be able to grow with the team and be in his prime when the leafs are ready to contend. Same with Kadri. Having that start to a rebuild with a team that wont be good in the next 2 to 3 years, is a very good start to a rebuild and will be doing things right. My only fear is that I hope reilly is the real deal to be a top pair dman, if not, i dont want to end up like edmonton with steller offense but nothing else. Im not sold on the duo of reimer and bernier yet.

                  • LN91 says:

                    I hate this “we will need to look for a Kessel” in the future crap. You need the building blocks before you add the final piece, which is why Burkes rebuild backfired through one trade.

                    You can find an elite scoring winger in this league. You cannot find the elite C’s or D-Men.

                    I prefer draft picks anyways, as Toronto would determine if they win the Kessel trade.

                    • Gambo says:

                      Yeah i can’t stand the “we will be looking for a kessel as soon as we trade him” crap either.

                      At best, this team will be competetive in what, 4 years? Kessel will be 31. I find it hard to believe Kessel will be anything more than a 60 point player in his 30s. The second he loses a step in speed he wont be anything special. By then at least one of Nylander or Brown or another draft pick winger will be a 60+ point player.

                      Kessel’s off season training that includes golf and wrist curls wont help him prolong his career as an elite offensive player.

                    • LN91 says:

                      Good point Gambo.

                      Even if you look at the last 7 years…The amount of scoring wingers that moved around has been large.

                      I think Seguin has been the only centre

                    • kessel_leafs81 says:

                      Just because you can find another scoring winger does not mean it will be easy nor cheap to do so. Im saying if were not trading kessel to help us draft a top line C or franchise player, whats the point of trading him? Do not take a discount on him and trade him for an average return, when we can easily be bad with him on our team and get a high draft pick, and when were good he still has potential to be huge for us in a couple of years when hes in more of a supporting scoring role.

  4. leafy says:

    Hats off to the Rangers for getting it done. Capitals took them to the limit.

    New York will have a MUCH easier time with Tampa.

    Chicago-Anaheim is really the Final. Whoever wins there will take the cup. I’m going with the Blackhawks.

    • nordiques100 says:

      Going to be 2 great series leafy.

      I think a big difference maker for the Rangers will be getting Zucerello back. If he can come back.

      And Tampa, we’ll see if Callahan can come back too.

      I think Jonathan Ericksson for the Wings came back after 3 days with an appendectomy. But its a tough call. Hard to know how each individual person reacts to this procedure.

      I love the depth of both teams. 3 really strong lines and D pairs on each team. There may be more game-breakers on the Bolts, but the Rags have Lundqvist.

      I think we’re going 7 again. It seems to be the Rangers way. But, if Stamkos is going, he looked great in game 6, I am not sure the Rangers can stop him as McDonagh can’t play 60 minutes. The Stamkos/Tyler Johnson 1-2 punch is awesome.

      For Rags, Nash needs to step up way better. I don’t think St. Louis can do it anymore. Love the way Brassard and Kreider play. And McDonagh, what more can you say? Amazing. Traded for Scott Gomez. hehe thought i’d throw that in there.

      The Western Series though will take the cake i think. The Ducks have played just 9 games. Don’t think it will be so quick here.

      The Hawks are just plain awesome. Crawford looks back to normal, and their lead dogs are doing just that. leading. However, can they handle the Ducks with just 4 D? That will be tough. Really tough. Not sure David Rundblad is anywhere as steady as Roszival.

      Don’t know about you, but Toews and Kane, just amazing. Its what i described above. Strome/Marner, maybe the Leafs lesser version of those two. If those two kids were a fraction of what Toews/Kane are, wow, that’s a pretty darn good player.

      Anyways, the way the Hawks play is awesome. And the Ducks too are exciting. I think the Ducks take it. Kesler I think knows a lot about losing to the Hawks. I think he’s had enough and will be the difference.

      Question will be if Andersen can keep the ship steady. I am wondering if we get a Gibson sighting here.

      Any combination. Ducks vs Bolts, Ducks vs Rags, Hawks vs Rags, Hawks vs Bolts, it will be a decent final.

      • leafy says:

        Nice analysis Nords. I could be wrong on this, but I’m still not completely sold on Tampa Bay. I can’t put my finger on it. Just seems they’re getting the right breaks at the right time and extremely fortunate to have come this far and there’s nothing remarkable about their play, as I can see, unless I’m missing something. The Rangers will be the penultimate test on this theory.

        • Gambo says:

          The 3 most important players on a team would probably be the #1 Center, #1 Dman, and #1 Goalie.

          Tampa has Stamkos, one of the best players in the league, Hedman, who I think is one of the best Dmen in the league, and Bishop, who is a fairly good starting goalie.

          Then they have Johnson and Kucherov, who have been incredible offensively all season and playoffs. The 1-2 punch they have offensively is hard to stop.

          Palat, Filppula are two extremely talented two way players.

          Callahan and Morrow are two players who were previously captains; along with Stamkos Tampa is well off leadership wise.

          Defensively Hedman and Stralman have been a good top pairing, Coburn has spent a lot of time being the top defenseman on Philly, but is better off suited for the #3 role he has in Tampa.

          I guess what I’m trying to say is I’m not surprised that they’re doing this well. I predicted them to make it to the conference finals, but yeah I don’t think they’ll go any further.

        • nordiques100 says:

          but playoffs are like that and if you have guys who can break a game open, like the guys on the Johnson line, or Stamkos, or Hedman where him and Stralman have been great, its sometimes all you need.

          Bishop too, just needs to be solid. The guy is a monster in net. If he can just be steady in there, they have a chance as they’re really confident about him.

          But, who’s at the other end? Lundqvist, where the Rangers have zero confidence issues with him.

          • leafy says:

            I recall I went absolutely nuts when the Leafs traded Stralman. Some people here even told me to get lost because I dared question the Leafs’ brain trust.

            • LN91 says:

              They have up on Stlalman too soon.

              But it’s the same with Gardiner leafy. I think you would need to make him a priority over Kadri.

              • leafy says:

                I read this Gardiner comparison elsewhere as well, but I totally disagree with it. Stralman was just soft, according to Burke and Wilson, not erratic. In contrast, Gardiner is one of the worst defencemen in the NHL and has a plus/minus close to the freezing point of nitrogen.

  5. leafy says:

    What a dominant win by Canada over Russia. The Russians are Canada’s call girl.

  6. leafy says:

    Leafs and Sabres are in a bidding war for Mike Babcock. $20 million over 5 years. Wow

    I’d coach the Leafs for even $50K if they covered gas + food.

  7. nordiques100 says:

    Done. Leafs hire Babcock

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